Useless Mercedes Dealers
Has anyone else heard the sob story about how challenging it is for cars dealers to make money in "this difficult market place"?
Well, they sure don't help themselves!
3 calls to 3 different dealerships - and the result: 2 no retuned calls (no doubt they'll be glad to add my telephone number to their spamming database) and 1 call back with the helpful "um, ah, you want to buy a what? A G? Do we make that"
I should have known better after dealing with the incompetent Mercedes Benz Brooklands but hope springs eternal!
So, the question to the knowledgably GWOA...
When the G was brought back into the UK, reports were that we would get the G350, G55 and the G300 Commercial.
However, there is no mention of the G300 Commercial on the Merc site and the one dealer who bothered to call back, didn’t even know what a G-Wagen was, let alone whether they could sell me a G300.
So, is the G300 available in the UK? If so, what is the EX-VAT price and what is the configuration? (2-seats, 5 seats?)
Most MB dealers I have spoke to know the G, but only by reputation and say thing like 'fantastic motor, don't build them like that any more' without really knowing anything more than that.
But other car dealers are worse. When buying a Fiat, I was an expert withing 24hours compared to the so called Car Sales Executive who simply knew nothing about the cars he was 'selling', nor what buttons did what, nor how to open the bonnet/boot etc. Useless. Ended up buying a Fiat from a Landrover dealer instead!
Have a look here.....
http://www.gwoa.co.uk/forum/g300-cdi-professional-no-longer-available-uk
..... it was apparently withdrawn from sale in the Uk in 2011.
Was it something around the £56K mark?
The boys who would know would be mr Perfect, Mark and possibly Howard as from memory they talked about it then almost died of fright.... In fact Mr Perfect was so disgusted he upped and left the country! :), MArk brought a Sprinter Van and Howard .... well brought a green thing called a Punch or something.
Spider1V
Your right it was circa £56k but it was Howard that tyre kicked and tried to get lowest price...but given the basic spec it had for that money it would have only attracted g fan boys with more money than sense...and MB realised this very quickly...I mean lik at all the G350 that their trying to unload.
G350 for £85,000 + is a different kettle of fish
I agree that £56,000 (to choose a number) is a lot of money and far too much; however, if the reality was that you could claim back circa £10,000 in VAT, it would make an expensive but interesting commercial vehicle purchase (especially second hand!), especially when you factor in the cost savings on company car liability.
Like most things, Mercedes UK seem to have the opposite of the midas touch when it comes to new G-Wagens.
Believe me Howard went down the route to see if the vat could be claimed back...he would have had one if at all possible.....then it would have been viable for more but wasn't to be..too many toyotas out there
Perhaps that is why Merc sold so few!
Very strange though because Mercedes themselves called it the G300 Commercial and therefore the implication is LGV.
How Land Rover can get away with the Defender 110 SW Utility (no issues with commercial status) and Merc could not do the same with the G300 is absurd.
Something to do with the seat arrangements on the landrover I believe
Land Rover had 2 up front and 3 across the back (bench - with a 70/30 split). All the have done is removed the two rear windows (in the load space) on a 110 SW. The rear window, rear passenger windows, safari windows and front windows are all in place.
If LR can achieve LGV status by removing 2 side, load area, windows, it seems astronomically stupid that Mercedes GB couldn't achieve the same.
http://www.lro.com/news.php?sid=257
I've seen the back of a 110 Utility and if that can hold 1000kg, the G300 could hold more.
I recall Howard said that it was the weight. Slightly less than the VAT requirement.
I struggle to believe the aluminium clad 110 is truly over 3 tonne and the G300 isn't.
I am sure Howard checked it out BUT I cannot believe Mercedes really pushed the case for the 300 being a Commercial vehicle. Considering the dross on the market, I question how clean cut the classification actually is.
The whole thing seems fishy.
hi aero94,
to add to your frustration, I'm afraid that the others are right: MB UK is completely useless and is in the business of pushing as many cars onto the roads as possible. As a result of this attitude I think they are losing a lot of friends in the LPG department lately as well. I have been wholly unimpressed with the dealerships and we live in an area where there are five Gs within a 5-10 mile radius! Even if you could get your G300 commercial on the road, as a commercial, your service bills would be horrendous at £90 per hour.....the whole ethos of MB UK absolutely stinks when it comes to supporting Gs, be they for private or commercial use.
Still, there is hope. A while back on mobile.de there was a dealer in Germany that was selling brand new G300 commercials in the mid 50k Euros. In terms of VAT, you could get it back as it is within the EU (although it might take while). Then all you have to find is a reliable Mercedes commercial specialist for servicing. I seriously looked at it but then decided against it, but out of other business reasons nothing to do with the viability.
Good luck,
Phileas
forgot to mention that the german dealer was selling RHD G300s.......
Guys I will need to look through my old paperwork but the problem you have with The G and Vat is the new rules state the vehicle has to have a carrying capacity of 1000kg. The Right hand drive Professional can carry 980kg. I called customs and excise to see if they accept the lower figure but as expected they said the figure is fixed at 1000kg. But the older PUR model is as eligible for Vat recovery as the carrying capacity is higher.
I was quoted £48K plus Vat for a new 5 door. Professional less 10% discount .
As far as I am aware Merc have sold one 461 right hand drive Professional through a UK dealer.
Thanks Howard, that is very helpful.
What is interesting, and the plot thickens, is that even Land Rover admit on their web site that the 110 Station Wagon with Utility pack only has a payload of 988kg -
http://www.landrover.com/gb/en/lr/defender/explore/utility-wagon/
In the brochure you posted, Mercedes state 990kg for the G300 (page 16)
So the Defender gets classed as a Commercial VAT free vehicle with a 988kg payload capacity and removal of 2 windows, whereas the G300 station wagon with 990 fails to make the grade. As before, I find it a strange situation.
Howard, one other question, when you mentioned the "older PUR" met the criteria, what production year did you mean?
(Defenders built in UK, Mercs down in Austria?)
Mercedes have often failed with the G in the UK, I mean we are deep in Land Rover Country after all and the MB dealers don't really have a professional sales team. Its almost an arrogance of ‘ if you have to ask the price, you can;t afford one’. Over the past 10-15 years of MB ownership I have seen a really poor quality in both the products, servicing as well as an overall ‘tarnish’ of arrogance. It’s such a shame that a once very reputable manufacture now is only interested if a) your Chinese, b) Arabic or c) a celebrity – any one else, its almost as if your wasting their time!
One of the reasons the Graz trip has been quiet, is that there have been some changes at MB UK, the friendly young woman I was dealing with has now moved off looking after the G Product, and her two replacements have not bothered to contact me at all!. Here we are, quite a large group of G Wagen enthusiasts and we get NOTHING from the manufacturer by way of support! - Once MB have decided to contact me, I will of course be inviting them to the AGM, as I understand when the Landy boys meet, LR send across their marketing team with the latest toy (say the evoke). For people to look at.... What do we get? Yes you can come to the factory but we want to charge you for EVERYTHING you want to do! Grrrrr.
OK Rant over but MB have us over a barrel, we could vote with our feet, but be honest in most of our cases they have made a dammed fine vehicle, its a shame their service does not match their product.... Mind you looking at some of the reports of the NEW G’s maybe it does.
Love an peace with the chicken grease
Spider1V
Fairly certain the VAT is only an issue with the station wagon, ie rear windows, and seats. 3 door van model won't have these issues.
Cars
In most cases, VAT-registered businesses can't reclaim the VAT when they buy a car.
VAT rules say that a car is any motor vehicle of a kind normally used on public roads. It must have three or more wheels and meet one of the following conditions:
It must be constructed - or adapted - mainly for carrying passengers.
It must have roofed accommodation behind the driver's seat. This must either be fitted with side windows already or be constructed - or adapted - so that side windows can be fitted.
In addition, the following are not cars for VAT purposes:
vehicles capable of accommodating only one person or suitable for carrying twelve or more people including the driver
caravans, ambulances and prison vans
vehicles of three tonnes or more unladen weight
special purpose vehicles, such as ice cream vans, mobile shops, hearses, bullion vans, and breakdown and recovery vehicles
*vehicles with a payload of one tonne or more*
It is strange that VAT can be claimed back on the LR, doesn't meet C&E's requirements any more then the G does. Payload under 1000KG, or am I missing something?
I suppose you could remove 21 KG of something from the Professional and then pay to have it re plated. These people re plate all the time,
Mark, that is my point. I understand the commercial criteria but the LR doesn't meet them.
If someone removed the two rear windows of a LWB PUR, it would be the same format; therefore, I'd be interested to see them fail it but allow the Defender.
Doing the conversion yourself is an expensive gamble and not one I'd risk.
They get away with it on D3 and 4's as well.
Hello Aero94, perhaps I can correct a point you made earlier that may have caused you some confusion.
The max payload figure that you quote for the LR 110 Utility of 988kg which can be found in their brochures and website is not the max payload figure used by C&E to give it a N1 commercial status.
Landrover calculate the max payload as gross vehicle weight minus kerb weight which is: 3050kg - 2062kg = 988kg. However LandRovers kerb weight includes a 75kg driver and a full tank of fuel.
For C&E purposes the kerb weight is defined as the 'Minimum UNOCCUPIED Kerb Weight'. This removes the notional 75kg driver weight and increases the payload by the same amount thus taking the max payload over the magical ton to 1063kg.
I hope this helps clarify things although it does not explain why Mercedes dropped the ball by having a payload of less than a ton on the PUR.
Thats interesting. Pretty certain Mercs figures are with driver + full tank too.
Hi
2011 461 Professional Brouchure lists as follows....
G300CDI Van Version
Kerb Weight 2585KG
GVW 3560KG
Payload 975KG
Kerb Wieght includes
Fuel Tank 90% full
Driver 68KG
Luggage 7KG
Tank Capacity approx 96Ltr
90% = 86.4Ltr
@ approx 0.9KG per Ltr = approx 78KG
So actual Payload circa 1128KG !!!!
By my workings anyway but still irrelivant....
Excellent info.
Surely thats a bit of a cock up having a gvw just over 3500kg
Found brochure
Older 280CDI has lower kerb weight. Never done in RHD though.
Hi
2009 one has what looks like a wieght calculation excluding driver etc?
Gav
Thanks BigBlock, that explains the discrepancy - thank you.
Gav, as always, thanks for your insight as well.
It does seem, as I expected, that Mercedes UK made a mistaken when introducing the PUR in the UK.
It would appear that LandRover went the extra distance to homologate the 110 Utility as a Commercial or Light Truck to give it N1 status where as Mercedes only homologated the PUR as a car giving it M2 status. M1 and M2 vehicles pay the higher rate of RFL duty and are not eligible for VAT recovery even if they do have a payload exceeding 1000kg.
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Thanks BigBlock, very useful.
So it appears they sold 1 and discontinued the option to purchase onetime in the UK.
Does anyone recall the MSRP?